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Author Topic: > DefleMask v0.12.0 RELEASED! <  (Read 195758 times)

Offline Wonderpanda

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> DefleMask 11 PRE-RELEASE! <
« Reply #405 on: September 13, 2015, 05:02:30 pm »
Other issues:

The samples imported seem to be one semitone UP from the original sample (noticeable when you use sample bass or guitar notes)

The muting buttons sometimes dont'work with pcm

Offline Delek

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> DefleMask 11 PRE-RELEASE! <
« Reply #406 on: September 13, 2015, 05:19:32 pm »
Muting buttons will work in next pre-release update.

I noticed that the volume in the SEGA PCM is a little bit too high. However, I didn't touch anything from the original MAME emulation. Seems that it is just how the chip is.

Could you please upload an example of:
* "the first time i play the loop the PCM has a volume and when it loops che volume changes."
* "Strange cracking noise, especially with bass drum samples"

Regarding to .vgm playback, I'm working to fix them asap.

Offline Demick12

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« Reply #407 on: September 13, 2015, 05:36:25 pm »
Same here with the kick drum popping. Ditto for the actual volume for PCM's not kicking in until next loop. For my samples, I had to lower the amp down to -50 to not get distortion. Gradius III Arcade samples used in this example, and made sure the samples were trimmed properly.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2015, 05:38:42 pm by Demick12 »
Brains:
MAX 330 MEGA
PRO GEAR SPEC

Body:
STRETCH ARMSTRONG

Offline Wonderpanda

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> DefleMask 11 PRE-RELEASE! <
« Reply #408 on: September 13, 2015, 06:02:02 pm »
Those issues are present in the dmf that i uploaded before. PROVA.dmf. the popping noise and the volume shift don't always show anyway, but they show quite often

Offline Delek

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« Reply #409 on: September 13, 2015, 06:23:07 pm »
Ok please check it out now. Samples are now aligned to a multiple of 256 rom memory space. SEGA PCM needs some specific stuff regarding to how the memory is mapped. Samples were interlacing before.

Offline mihaelkyeah

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« Reply #410 on: September 13, 2015, 09:49:08 pm »
I tested the earlier pre release and I too experienced the volume change in the PCM channels, and also the very small "after release" click that the kick and snare samples had, particularly, and I suppose it's something the SegaPCM used to have since in the Super Hang-On soundtrack you can hear something similar in the bass drum. I suppose the solution would be to leave a tiny, say, 50ms or 100ms space after the sample is done so as to give it "more room" for the sample cut glitch not to be audible (it wasn't noticeable in the open high hat sample, this is why I'm assuming this.) C:

Also, I've been experiencing this since the earlier pre releases, and maybe even the Defle 10d. When I loop a song using the jump position command (BXX), it does like a very small freeze in Defle, and the resulting looped VGM has drums, or bass, or certain instruments in general missing as a result. For example, in a Mega Drive song with PCM drums, I had to enter the 17 trigger numerous times for it to stay enabled when the song looped, and in a YM2151 song, the bass and drums disappeared. If I export the song unlooped and loop it with Valley Bell's vgm_trim, it does well, but if I try to loop it directly from DefleMask it behaves strangely.
If you want me to send you a VGM export, I'll finish polishing some details in the latest (and first YM2151) song I made and attach it here, or maybe you can test this yourself.

Offline Delek

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« Reply #411 on: September 13, 2015, 10:52:07 pm »
Ok, so, yes the SEGA PCM volume is ultra high (a hardware thing). So I limit volume to 7F max in order to make it more user friendly (FF makes mixing very hard, clipping all over the place)

Volume changes were solved too, it was related with trying to control clipping. It should work fine now.

EDIT: Mac build also ready to download.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2015, 11:18:36 pm by Delek »

Offline Delek

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« Reply #412 on: September 13, 2015, 11:31:55 pm »
I need help trying to define the name of the "System". I mean: SN76489 + YM2151 = SEGA Genesis. HuC6280 = PC Engine. SID = Commodore 64.
YM2151 + SEGA PCM = ?? Arcade Machine?, SEGA X board?, simply YM2151 + PCM?

Offline LukeMcQueen

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> DefleMask 11 PRE-RELEASE! <
« Reply #413 on: September 13, 2015, 11:46:51 pm »
Just tried the latest build. Yep, clipping shouldn't be a problem anymore.
I encountered a bug though. Open the .dmf I attached here and delete the OFF note in the SP2 channel (or go to samples and preview the D note). It should only play the crash cymbal, but instead it plays the other two samples as well.
Also there's another thing: When the song loops for the second time (and the fourth, the sixth and so on) it doesn't do it as smooth, it seems to re-initialize/OFF all the channels.

EDIT: To answer your question regarding the YM2151+SegaPCM system, Sega X Board could be alright, but I think you should just name it YM2151+PCM, because of the missing channels.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2015, 11:53:30 pm by LukeMcQueen »

Offline Delek

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« Reply #414 on: September 14, 2015, 01:03:39 am »
Thanks for reporting it.
Regarding to the sample not finishing, it has to do with the duration of the sample (I think SEGA PCM has a time limit per sample). I will look into it.
The other thing, yes, I was re-writing the SEGA PCM rom on every loop, something only needed the first time. It is fixed and will be available in the next pre-release update.

Any other bugs?

Offline mihaelkyeah

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« Reply #415 on: September 14, 2015, 01:19:10 am »
So is the looping bug fixed? As far as I've experienced it does not only affect PCM channels but also FM.

Offline Delek

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« Reply #416 on: September 14, 2015, 01:23:57 am »
So is the looping bug fixed? As far as I've experienced it does not only affect PCM channels but also FM.
This one?

When I loop a song using the jump position command (BXX), it does like a very small freeze in Defle, and the resulting looped VGM has drums, or bass, or certain instruments in general missing as a result.
Please upload a .dmf as example. Bug reports without .dmf attached can be randomly ignored. :P

Offline mihaelkyeah

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« Reply #417 on: September 14, 2015, 01:36:59 am »
Fair enough. I will post a topic in the bug reports section, with the respective dmf's and vgm's attached when I have access to a computer with internet connection, which might be tomorrow in the afternoon.

Offline 3noneTwo

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> DefleMask 11 PRE-RELEASE! <
« Reply #418 on: September 14, 2015, 02:31:00 pm »
I haven't had a chance to really try out the new additions (dealing with a PC failure), but it's awesome to see the new chips being supported so quickly.

The 7F volume limitation should be fine. If we need samples to be any louder, the Amp setting is available in the Instruments window.

I'm not sure how I feel about samples being automatically set to specific notes, instead of being treated as separate instruments. It makes sense for drum-kits, but it seems like a weird design choice otherwise.
I haven't heard it in many games (Rail Chase is one example, #3 and #4), but it seems SegaPCM is capable of playing samples at different semitones/playback rates. Or is that achieved in the SegaPCM by setting multiple samples to specific pitches?

Regarding the name for YM2151+SEGAPCM, both chips were commonly seen together in the X Board and Y Board. Something like "X/Y Board" or "X/Y Arcade"?
« Last Edit: September 14, 2015, 02:55:56 pm by 3noneTwo »

Offline Delek

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« Reply #419 on: September 14, 2015, 03:15:12 pm »
I'm not sure how I feel about samples being automatically set to specific notes, instead of being treated as separate instruments. It makes sense for drum-kits, but it seems like a weird design choice otherwise.
I haven't heard it in many games, but it seems SegaPCM is capable of playing samples at different semitones/playback rates. Or is that achieved in the SegaPCM by setting multiple samples to specific pitches?
It is achieved by having multiple pitches for the same sample.
I don't know why the SEGA PCM is considered a powerful chip, it is only a player of raw data from an external ROM hardware. It doesn't have even its own memory.

What Rail Chase did on track 3 is to change the sampling rate, so it will play at different pitch but also different speed. That formula won't work for instruments, because you are not controlling the pitch in a precise way. It is suitable only for SFX.

EDIT: The one that can control PITCH, ATTACK, TREMOLO, VIBRATO on Samples is the SEGA MultiPCM (Daytona USA, Virtua Cop, Virtua Racing, etc). It is a complete different story, maybe a future addition to DefleMask.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2015, 03:30:50 pm by Delek »